In Game Advice and Poker IQ Scores
Just started playing around with the full-ring game (I usually play 6-max cash online but do play full ring live) and made a habit out of checking the in game advice after I made my decision to see how it matched up to how I would play the hand unassisted. Well, I have to say that I questioned the advice quite a bit. It seemed very passive and the river bluffs it suggested were lines that made zero sense much of the time.
Examples:
1) UTG holding AJo: In cash play I am either folding this or raising it. Advice was to limp.
2) UTG+1 holding TT: UTG limped and advice was to limp behind. I can't see this play as being +EV.
3) SB: Holding 5/2o with 2 limpers it suggested calling but holding 8/10s and 4 limpers it suggested not wasting any more money in the hand. I believe I am at least calling there and on occasion will raise strong.
4) River bluffs not capping the action where they would have made zero sense. I'm holding no blockers to where flush and/or straight draws made it (or nothing did) and didn't bet my draws. One time I'm in the BB so invested exactly nothing into the hand that has been checked down to the river. I'm supposed to bet into 5 other players that I made exactly what hand that I wasn't drawing to before? Who is going to believe a line like that?
There were many other examples in that 300 hand session but suffice it to say that I'm confused here. It was a profitable session despite some horrible beats but the poker IQ scores show that I played pretty poorly. Well, if the benchmark is how the advisor would have played the hands, then sure. I'm wondering how those IQ scores are calculated and whether I should pay attention to them or not. I understand that this is very early in my training here but for the life of me I can't agree with some of the lines suggested.
Thanks in advance for any and all comments. If it helps, my winning rate over 300 hands was 37.03BB/100 but my overall IQ was only 107. The biggest places I disagreed with the advisor were pre-flop and flop.
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Reviewed some hands with different pros fro the dropdown menu and got different comments than from in-game advisor. Also, I made a mistake above - Advisor suggested folding AJo UTG, not limping it. My bad. Still, the lines taken seemed very passive and not conducive to taking pots on later streets, knowing we are behind on the flop but having opponent on vulnerable medium strength hands.
Now, I do mostly play short-handed so I'm used to having wider ranges than most full-ring players but I believe in having a balanced approach and having bluff hands in my 3-bet range along with my premiums etc. Is this a view shared by the site or is the site more devoted to strengthening ABC poker? Nothing wrong with it either way but I am curious to know what the definition of "perfect play" is here vs GTO.
Actually I believe that 107 is a pretty good IQ score. Here is a link to how your IQ is calculated:
https://www.advancedpokertraining.com/poker/skillsrating.php
I agree that 107 is a pretty good score. The IQ is not compared to advisor decisions, it is compared with mathematically correct decisions as if all cards were face up, and in comparison to other players. In terms of the advice, there will definitely be cases where it doesn't make a lot of sense because they are computers. There are several other threads that discuss the advisors where I get into more detail. Here is a link to one:
https://www.advancedpokertraining.com/poker/forum/discussion/203/why-does-apt-app-recommend-limping-in-with-certain-hands-to-open-pots
Thanks to both of you and sorry if I ask too many questions. Trying to figure out how to get the most of this site and so I need to kick the tires and look under the hood until I know what's what. I read the links provided and appreciate the direction though I'm still not getting a great picture of the IQ calculation.
In terms of "mathematically correct", does this take into consideration only direct odds or does it have a way of including implied odds? Pot equity only or can it factor in fold equity? i.e. Can a semi-bluff raise be marked as a good play even though it is mathematically incorrect using only direct odds?
Say hero is on Axs and is initial aggressor in position. 3 see a flop. Flop is Q93 putting 4 to a flush out there for hero's hand. 1st to act bets 2/3rds pot and is flatted by other player (ok, its horrible but for the sake of argument lets say this happened). Mathematically we are to the good for a call but depending on situation and players this may be a great time for a semi-bluff raise or sometimes a shove. We may be able to fold out all/most 1-pair hands and weaker flush/straight other than J10s. Pot odds say no but add in say 35% fold-equity to our 35% pot equity and now the math works out for this play.
I've been playing recreationally for quite a number of years, mostly live. I've been profitable at decent stakes and have a positive ROI in tournament play, though I haven't played a ton of them. The competition is getting so much better in the past few years that I need to work on my game if I ever hope to do more than min-cash in multi-day tournaments going forwards. The game online seems to be much tougher than live at comparable stakes as well so I'm playing substantially below where I should be using conservative bankroll management.
I've never had any training other than what I've read or practiced or discussed with other players. Any advice on how best to use this site to bring my game from decent recreational player to somewhat competitive player would be great.
My guess is that the PokerIQ answer would be the following:
For those times when they call - Your IQ would go down (because you weren't getting the correct odds at the moment).
For those times when they fold - Your IQ would go up (because they folded incorrectly).
To the extent that you have estimated the situation correctly (i.e. 35% fold equity), your overall IQ would be higher.
Also I believe that each street (pre-flop, flop, turn and river) has its own IQ score and then there is an overall score that is a weighted-average of all 4 streets. So you might get down-ticked on the flop but up-ticked even more on the turn and/or river for those times when they pay you off.
That's my guess. I will interested to learn what part I got right and what part I missed because that will help me develop a deeper understanding of how it works.